You Get What You Deserve
Darin and Amy discuss the age old human philosophy where we believe we ultimately get what we deserve in life. Whether we openly admit to it or just subconsciously struggle with it, there’s something inside each of our hearts that sometimes wonders if we aren’t all eventually going to get paid back for every wrong thing we’ve done. Arriving to an answer as to what we deserve is a bit more complicated then just adding up what a person has done or where they’ve been. This is precisely what religion had been doing for hundreds of years. In the end, it isn’t “religion” that we stand before; it’s our Father. Fathers determine what we deserve, not by the rules we’ve broken or the things we’ve done. Fathers determine this by our NAME.
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I have always believed that blessing was someone else not me even though I have been blessed . I have a daughter and when you made the point about your daughter it knocked me for a loop I thought I would never think that my daughter deserved bad treatment because she was bad and then the lights came on! My God thinks the same way wow!! Thanks for the podcast. Joe
No wonder there are so many depressed Christians in the world. Gr8 podcast, thanks!
I have been circling your camp since Nov./11. So much of what I have heard and read(Misunderstood God is great!) pierces through and looks incredibly liberating. I find within myself so many "constructs" effectively penning me in to sin-centered living. My hope remains (with your confidence Darin) that Holy Spirit will anchor His Truth so as to make dust of the falsehoods and root within me His Love/Grace message, Thanks to all of you for sharing your excitement and love for the message and those to whom you bring it.
I think the only thing missing in this discussion is a definition of what is the "best" and what sin held us away from. The best, greatest treasure is access to the heart of our Abba Father and to ever more deeply enjoy him and reflect him in the world. This is why I came to this site. I had never encountered a better call to and description of his heart than "The Misunderstood God". I was captivated and have given away about 20 copies. I thought the last podcast was signalling a return to this theme because it was "back to love". Personally, I know I do, but I think I should not care less what I "deserve". I "get" to be a child of my Father and come to him with confidence whether I deserve it or not. Thanks for helping me continue my journey. I spend much needed time thinking and clarifying the truth I really want to embrace in my heart after listening to you.
Hi Cody, I really appreciate what I am reading from your heart. "The best, greatest treasure is access to the heart of our Abba Father..." MY greatest struggle is to clear away all this debris about and around what I deserve. I feel kind of like I am looking into/over the Promised Land - but there are giants there. I recognize the validity of FB themes/message - the problem is not in identifying so much as embracing - are you finding that thinking/clarifying truth purposefully over time sufficient towards freeing the heart to fully embrace this message? Is it sufficient to just "accept" the grace/love reality and "deal" with historic internal/external objections as they arise?
I do appreciate your thoughts Cody - I "see" a heart longing in you - of a kind that I desire for myself - I just seem 2 have a lot of garbage 2 wade through - still... Abba Father is the other Participant in our quest(s) I am confident that He is drawing me 2 Himself - through others just a yourself - So Thanks!
Andre,
Do you think this might help you? I posted this on another site:
Here's an interesting personal discipline to take on for a season:
What if every time you thought of yourself in a negative light, justified the crap you are going through, or believed the garbage happening is you getting what you deserved: you sat down and said, would a parent do that to his kids? Would I do that to my kids? Don't parents favor their kids? Don't they have this HUGE CRAVING to pour out grace on their kids? What if you committed yourself to a season of destroying the enemies' lies about God, yourself, your relationship, and your walk together through this? What would you like to get out of a season of committing yourself to 'letting your heart be established by grace" Heb 13:9? Just how much might this effect your faith in God? Enable you to walk the path of life-changing hope? Increase your ability to love?
One of the most brilliant themes of The Misunderstood God (to me) lies in Darin's exposure of the incongruity of (much of the) I.C. presentation of the character of God in the face of real life - healthy relational dynamics between parents and children in familial love. I weep with the beauty of Darin's relationship(s) with his loved ones as he expresses them in his book and through his podcast conversations. I needn't go into detail here, but my experiences have been "otherwise". I recognize within me a lingering conflict with regard 2 the sovereignty of God - (How could a loving God let me experience the things I did?) I think I have heard most of the stock answers, that isn't the "biggy" anymore - I am in the season of stripping away dead things - somewhere underneath of all that has become a distorted shadow of me.There is a "me" that went into hiding - how can I let my heart be established in grace without first finding my heart?How can I begin 2 know God when I've lost who I am?
Andre- Here's a story. In the greatest pain/grieving in my life, i saw a picture while praying of a little girl sitting in a corner weeping over being unloved. I said,"is that me, Lord? Should I tell her you love her? Do I need to just cry with her?" He answered, "That's your sin nature. Go kill it." I realized that since I have mercy gifting this was the perfect disguise...and I realized Jesus wasn't kidding. I studied how to go about doing that, and one day I just resorted to asking him (duh!), "what should I say or do to my sin nature?" What I heard next was a bluegrass band (my heritage) with Jesus singing lead, "Die,die, you gravy sucking pig! Get up on that cross where you belong! You've masqueraded as my heart for far too long. I'm supposed to hate what's evil so quess what? I'm hatin' you!" You should hear the verses! So I ask for daily revelation of(with a desire to do violence to) my sin nature. I kill it by grace walking in the exact opposite way. My heart is easier to find!
Cody - maybe I am really "thick" (headed) - but I am chuckling right now - my first thought response is "When Christ Jesus died - I (that is my sin nature) died with Him! This is so plain to see right now - yet I have found that really difficult to keep in "sight" - I have been attracted to the message of the finished work of Christ and the complete sufficiency of His redemptive work - sins past,present,future forgiven-guaranteed going to heaven - all great news!I get that in some way I lean towards protecting /nurturing my wounds and the sin-filled selfishness of that. I should think that I would be totally done with that - I've been doing the guilt/fear/shame/condemnation/etc. circuit for decades. I don't think I can wait to recognize my "heart" - or for a feeling to get me going - this seems like a simple decision to do an about-face - I am not sure what grace walking is - but I can certainly identify what is harmful and choose to do the opposite. I am not sure of what that is yet.
Really loved this podcast. It's for every member of our generation. Keep living, guys!
Thanks Mason. Blessings my friend:)
Andre,
It's in grace that you find your heart. When you let God be love, you rest and let your heart soak up what His goodness means. He restores your soul. He makes you whole. He brings your true self forth from the shadows. We don't go back to before the IC. We go forward in a resurrection from that deadness that informs our heart with much more wisdom, compassion and love than we had before the IC shriveled us.
I appreciate the thoughts and experiences expressed on this site. Right now I remain uncertain of who I am or what I believe anymore.
I just know that I need to live and think differently than I do. I was born and raised "I.C" - there is no "before the I.C." for me - there was a time when I was living and walking a very hard road without church or God - I survived - by my wits and/or by His grace - I won't commit to say either/or... I just know I am very tired of this struggle and I know that I don't trust what I have previously "believed" anymore... I don't know God as some of you seem to be saying you do - I no longer presume to think I can - so I guess I'm a "goat" at least for now - God help me to see different - I gotta go - Peace to you all - Darin - I really appreciate the message you are carrying - I will direct folks to check you out - especially those around me from the university crowd- I think they will "get it" with enthusiasm - thanks again and take care
Andre it grieves me to hear you say you're a goat. That's silly. None of us "get it" perfectly. None of us know Him as much as we'd like too. I think you're comparing yourself with what you perceive others are getting and anytime you do that you'll always end up feeling behind the crowd. Please understand that this message is NOT about not going to church. Leaving the IC is something that only about half of the people who call themselves Free Believers have done. It's about understanding that GOD IS LOVE. Andre if you haven't read my book "The Misunderstood God" yet, PLEASE do so right away. I'll mail you a copy for free if finances are an issue. It's a wonderful place to start. I'll also send you the teaching series on the book. It's basically where most of us started when we got this revelation of His heart. This isn't something you get for being a deep Christian. This is actually something that the simple minded people get:) It's a truth at only the little children get:)
Darin the last ting I want to do is grieve you - or anyone else - I haven't left the I.C. (although I did take a 2 month break during renovations) I still have to "lead" music ministry, at least until I can find a replacement - earlier on this page I indicated that I have read "The Misunderstood God" I have listened to the love series and every one of your podcasts since the very first one you posted. In Nov. 11 I was very angry when I began to understand the spiritual death I submitted to within the doctrines/religion of my church. I haven't forgotten times when I believed God to be at work within the practices of our denomination. His love and grace have been evident among His church - that is the PEOPLE - albeit too few - with whom I have relationships - and even fewer whom I love dearly - and would so love any/every circumstance. Darin, read the earlier posts - but I can't really clarify underlying stuff here - establishing authenticity within me is the ghost I can't chase anymore
I usually don't read through all the posts. I just address the ones that really stick out to me and your last one did. Andre, I hope you know that the majority of Free Believers go through a long period where they don't even feel they know God after they leave the institutional system. For some of us, it lasts several years. It's a time where we don't know what to say, we don't know how we feel, we question whether or not we even hear His voice at all. Everything is called into question and we feel very isolated. This is totally normal. I just want to encourage you to take a deep breath and keep waking. Don't have any expectations. That's the real problem with most of us. We have these expectations of what a relationship with God looks and feels like and no matter how hard we try, we just can't meet them. It's always better to just let all expectations go and keep walking. If He's real, He'll find YOU.
Okay Andre I just read through your last posts. In fact I just read through all your posts that you've put up on this site. I know who you are now. It gives me a much better idea of where you're at. I don't feel so grieved now:)
Darin I am delighted to make your acquaintance :) Listening to your conversations with Robert, both Amiee's, and so many others has been a real anchor for me - I love you all so much just for who you show yourselves to be. By His Grace...
Thanks so much Andre.
LOVED this!! A talk that was so along these same lines from Rob Bell called " The gods aren't angry".. so so good if you have a chance to watch!
I wonder if there is just something innate and primitive in our thinking that things God is angry at us. Our heads anyway.. I think our spirit totally gets that He adores us, and that we are so deserving because of His love and the place He has given us in His kingdom. I had a really big " ah ha" moment when you and Am were talking... something had come to my attention just recently about really not believing that I am beloved and that I do indeed deserve all that God has. And I think it's that old teaching, just like you said, that I am a dirty worm that doesn't deserve anything good, and thank goodness for Jesus coming and taking all the anger from a pissed off God on my behalf. For me, I am realizing it's really a belief that is drilled down really deep. I can sense it really strong on some days.. something looming over me,
saying to me.. " You are bad. Amy is bad." and it's shame and it's the critical voice that I learned so long ago from that whole false teaching.
Such great great food for thought.. thankyou.